|Socialism||Socialism is great, just look at Nordic countries.||Nordic countries aren't socialist, they are having major problems, and if you look at all the Socialist countries around the globe (North Korea, Venezuela, Cuba), and throughout history (Cambodia, Vietnam, China, USSR, etc), there are those that sucked, and those that are going to suck. Cherry picking is great for pies, but lousy for learning from life.|
Three most common quotes by Socialists
Socialism was founded and is rooted deep in envy, hate and control -- all primal emotions, which is why it is hard to combat with reason, facts or evidence.
While Socialism has always been around, it's current resurgence started in the 1800's while industrialization was starting in Europe. Workers had a choice: (a) live in rural farms, scraping by as indentured servants to the land-owners (b) move to the cities and do factory work and have higher incomes, live in slightly less squalor and have slightly better conditions. Many were choosing (b).
Socialists knew that while these people's conditions were better than the alternative, that many weren't getting ahead as fast as they would have liked, and there was abuse. So they preyed upon that frustration, greed, and envy at those more successful they are. And Marx and Engles came along and codified these old ideas into a collection of fables called the Communist Manifesto. And they invented bullshit anti-economics, that have all been disproven, like their ideas that economics is a fixed pie, thus the owner and worker are always at odds over "surplus value". The opposite is actually true: a thriving company is creating new value and sharing it with their employees -- and without the employer the people aren't better off, they're unemployed. But alas, if Socialists could learn, they would have gone extinct long ago.
In the end, Socialism can only work for short periods of time, and if you have nothing to compare it to. It is basically the idea that you should punish those who work the hardest and succeed the most, and reward the most, those that do the opposite (and live off everyone else). When you first eat the rich, and redistribute what is theirs, it is tasty, and the lower people are better off. Then over time, innovation slows, bureaucracy takes over, performance declines as the disincentives take root. Then your culture learns the futility of effort, the rewards in cheating the system, resentment at the system and others for their miserable existence, and you get a malaise. Atlas shrugs. The hard working leave, or go where they will be rewarded: criminal enterprise or party politics. Both are parasites on innovation and growth, and the economy may perform in spite of it, but it performs less than the alternative. This is why every socialist system collapses, the only question is how slow will that society mature and grow past it?
There are three forms of Socialism: Democratic Socialism, Revolutionary Socialism (Marxism/Communism), and Corporate Socialism (Fascism or Capitalistic Socialism).
Here's just a few examples of when Socialism was tired, and it ended poorly: 7 items
American Socialism - There's a fiction that "Real Socialism" hasn't been tried. And when that's disproven by history, the American Socialists often fall back to, "well it hasn't been tried here", which shows even more ignorance. Here's a few examples of American Socialist Communes that were tried and failed:
- 1607 - Jamestown, Virginia -- after attempted socialism failed, they converted to private ownership (capitalism) and survived.
- 1747 - The Shakers
- 1817 - I toured Zoar, Ohio, which is part of what got me more interested in researching this topic (and vice versa).
- 1841 - Brook Farm, Mass (Ripley's Follow Me or Not)
- 1842 - Fruitlands Commune
- 1856 - Octagon City, the Vegetarian Utopia
- 1930's - Fordlandia: Henry Ford tried to bring a slice of America to the Brazilian jungle
- 1967- Kaliflower Commune
- 1972 - 12 Tribes
Communism - Communism is just Revolutionary or Radical Socialism. Fascism is just Socialism with indirect control over the means of production. (E.g. businesses are proxies for the party, as long as they remain compliant). There's a bunch of debate about irrelevant nuances between Communism versus Socialism -- but the major ideas, and outcome is the same. (By using businesses as proxy for the state, there's a little bit more variances in fascism). Communism and Fascism seem more likely to coalesce around a single central authority figure (Leader) to enforce equality and Socialistic policies.
Democratic National Socialism - Babylon Bee hits the satire out of the park by claiming the Nazi's want to be called the Democratic Nazi's now, as if the word democratic makes it all better. Democratic Racism, Democratic Censorship, Democratic Genocide, Democratic Rape, which of those things is made better by putting Democratic in front of it? And the same goes for Democratic Socialism, whether it is Democratic National Socialism, or Democratic Globalist Socialism makes little difference to the people being oppressed.
How to prove Socialist don't believe in Socialism - I have this discussion fairly often: there's something like a teachers strike, and my response is the tax system should be voluntary and allow the taxpayers to direct their money (in whole or in part) where they want. So the voters direct how much of their money goes to the general fund, education (the school budget) and so on. The same with roads, military, foreign aid and many other things should be based on taxpayer-directed funds. The school/districts job is only how to budget (direct) the money they get wisely -- and let the statistical averages decide the macro budget. (And agencies don't get to borrow, only spend what's directed to them)....
Memes:Fascism - Memes about Fascism
Memes:Socialism - Memes about Socialism!
So what did we learn? That's a joke, if Socialists could learn, they would have gone extinct thousands of years ago. What some of us learned is that Socialism can work for a short while, but central planning always underperforms a free market. They may collapse in 5 years, or may struggle for 50, but the idea that the central planners know more than everyone else, is flawed at it's nature. What happens is that they focus on the best producing industries, and run them more efficient by eliminating competition. But while that leanness looks good in the short term, it suffocates innovation, and it destroyed diversity of their economy (everything becomes about the few things the planners are focused on, and everything else starves out). Then when enough innovation happens in their key industry (and the didn't keep up), or a disruptive technology comes along, they all suffocate and have nothing else to fall back on. And the real illiterates will claim, "Real Socialism has never been tried", and invent a reason for why another failure doesn't count.
Communism is just Revolutionary or Radical Socialism. Fascism is just Socialism with indirect control over the means of production. (E.g. businesses are proxies for the party, as long as they remain compliant). There's a bunch of debate about irrelevant nuances between Communism versus Socialism -- but the major ideas, and outcome is the same. (By using businesses as proxy for the state, there's a little bit more variances in fascism). Communism and Fascism seem more likely to coalesce around a single central authority figure (Leader) to enforce equality and Socialistic policies. more...
Links to more
- Perfect score = 100% failure rate: https://fee.org/articles/you-cant-argue-against-socialisms-100-percent-record-of-failure/